Doctor Who Club of Australia

Panecea

Do any of you recall the Collin Baker episode, Trial of a Time Lord? The reason I asking is due to the fact that he is supposed to have a "change of morals", as it were, between his twelfth and thirteenth regenerations. Any thoughts on how they will deal with this in the new series?

charlie · Posted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 8:40 pm Post subject:

I don't think they'll bother. More likely a book or audio will deal with it.

Sulp Niar · Posted: Sat Mar 31, 2007 10:25 am Post subject:

Can the Valeyard even still work? I mean, according to the NAs the Doctor killed his Sixth incarnation in an effort to make sure the Valeyard never happened (though I don't exactly know how this makes sense, especially because he evolved into the dark Seventh). But now that the Time Lords and Gallifrey are gone, how can the Trial ever have happened? How can the Valeyard travel back? I'm not saying that it's not possible for the Valeyard to eventually surface, but since the Doctor's timeline seems to be entirely different now, they probably don't have to deal with it.

And, to be honest, I don't want them to reach the Thirteenth incarnation.

Panecea · Posted: Sat Mar 31, 2007 12:27 pm Post subject:

I'd would think the most likely way would be, as charlie suggested, to explain it away in a book or audio but it would be good if they do find a way to bring it to televison. It would be very fitting, considering the Master is returning, to bring it up in the next few seasons.

As for not wanting the Doctor to reach his thirteenth regeneration, it is inevitable. Whether or not he becomes evil he can't avoid regeneration, it is like a human trying to avoid death.

Greg · Posted: Sat Mar 31, 2007 12:50 pm Post subject:

Regardless of whether it is a sensible idea or not, what does 'between the twelfth and thirteenth regenerations mean from a practical sense? There isn't a period of time between the different incarnations of the Doctor, so the Valeyard comes from a no-place and a no-time.

To me, it's like 'between today and tomorrow', it sounds impressive enough but doesn't exist. It passes without anyone noticing.

Panecea · Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 1:33 pm Post subject:

Yet, he seems to have ( at least in Trial of a Time Lord) imprinted himself in space time; as if he was a separate entity. If he was truly a momentary event then no matter what the Valeyard did, the time line would automatically correct itself. Meaning that the trial never happened. However, it is still referenced in future events.

Perhaps, his thirteenth regeneration didn't quite go to plan.

You could also say the Time Lords, as a race, come from no place and no time. However, their concept of time-space is not linear, it doesn't follow any pattern of time as we know it.

charlie · Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 4:54 pm Post subject:

Greg · Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 6:44 pm Post subject:

Sulp Niar · Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 8:04 pm Post subject:

Panecea · Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2007 5:17 pm Post subject:

My apologies, Greg. You are correct. Perhaps a more appropriate term to use would be incarnation. However, the more important item here is that we seem to have a general consensus on the matter.

If the Doctor dies at all, (as the BBC have left this matter open) the fans can write the missing chapters. After all telvision only show us part of his life story. There is still many a question left unanswered and if the Doctor survives the television series then it truly is a testament to his longevity.

Greg · Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2007 6:56 pm Post subject:

It's probably at least in part my high level of antipathy with Doctor Who starring Colin Baker, produced by John Nathan Turner with Eric Saward as the script editor. It was a quite awful period for the show! When people ask me to think about it too much, there is a risk that I will start frothing at the mouth...

Of course, Colin Baker is a far better Doctor than he was ever allowed to be on TV, and the JNT/Saward combo produced better stories with Peter Davison, so it is the combination that seems to be a losing combination for me.

Panecea · Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 4:39 pm Post subject:

I didn't like the 6th incarnation of the Doctor in the television series but he was good in the animated episode, Real Time.

charlie · Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 8:49 pm Post subject:

I think Colin is a strong contestor for best Doctor on the audios but his TV eps were strong contestors for worst. Cept maybe Revelation of the Daleks

Fenric · Joined: 01 Feb 2007 Posts: 10

Perhaps the Valeyard wasn't actually part of the Doctor's future- it was just a story of the Master's?

Forgive me if the story contradicts me, because the Trial of a Time Lord wasn't interesting enough to remember anything.

silver_smurfer · Joined: 25 Jan 2006 Posts: 22 Location: Launceston

SharazJek · Joined: 12 Aug 2005 Posts: 932 Location: Hobart, Tasmania

I haven't read this whole thread so I don't know if this has been mentioned but, to quote The Five Doctors:

On the first Doctor meeting the fifth:

1st Doctor: Regeneration?

5th Doctor: Fourth.

So, the correct terminology would be the Doctors' 12th and 13th 'incarnations', NOT regenerations. 13 regenerations would imply he has 14 bodies. He can only regerate 12 times. He has done so now 9 times.

silver_smurfer · Joined: 25 Jan 2006 Posts: 22 Location: Launceston